Macrame pixel knot vs upside-down alpha
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Bullfish
Advanced
Bullfish
2 months, 2 weeks ago by Bullfish
Which type of knotting do you prefer on alphas?
- upside-down knotting
- macrame pixel knotting

Personally, I prefer the macrame pixel knotting. For me this technique on the one hand makes very straight, squary knots and on the other hand does not compress the knots as much as the upside-down technique. Final result. in my opinion, is closer to "normal" knotting than in upside-down technique.
Upside-down technique actually shows the backside of "normal" knotting as the frontside and therefore is is way more flat and compressed and less structured for my eyes.

As for the knotting itself, both techniques are just slightly different from "normal" knotting and both are just a matter of practice.

The only thing, on both techniques, is: I couldn`t yet find a way to work these as a clean back alpha. Whatever I tried, it won`t work for me. Did anyone find a way for a clean back on either of these two techniques?
halokiwi
Moderator
halokiwi
2 months, 2 weeks ago by halokiwi
Can you link images of examples?
halokiwi
Moderator
halokiwi
2 months, 2 weeks ago by halokiwi
About making these clean-back:

The upside-down alpha technique is the regular alpha technique but upside down. If you use the clean-back alpha technique on a regular alpha, the back will be clean. Therefore you have an upside-down alpha with a clean back. Or am I misunderstanding something?
Bullfish
Advanced
Bullfish
2 months, 1 week ago by Bullfish
Well, due to the fact that knotting is the opposite of "normal" knotting, I could not yet find a way to carry along other strings, that are not in use at that moment. It is easy to do that with "normal" knotting though.
Personally I prefer the macrame pixel knotting as the final product has extremely straight knots but more structure than the upside-down technique.
My first alphas, must be like 15 years ago, were just with "normal" knotting and I always hated the fact, that the knots tended to lean right in forwards rows and left in backwards rows and I am knotting since the late 1980s. I adjusted every single knot, but that for alphas were like a never ending story.
Okay, I am a perfectionist, but with macrame pixel knotting knots are straight and little squares, just as they should be and without the need to adjust. So definitely way more fun for me.

Anyway, the question was, which technique other knotters prefer and why.
halokiwi
Moderator
halokiwi
2 months, 1 week ago by halokiwi
Do you have a link to an example of the macrame pixel technique?

I think most knotters are unfamiliar with it. So it is probably only going to be a very small minority.

Most do regular alphas and a few do upside-down alphas.

-

Maybe I didn't explain my thinking properly:

If you do the clean-back alpha technique, both the back and the front will be clean.
If you do the clean-back alpha technique, the back will be identical to the upside-down alpha technique, only mirrored.
So wouldn't just doing a clean-back alpha with the image mirrored equal to an upside-down alpha with a clean back?
Bullfish
Advanced
Bullfish
2 months, 1 week ago by Bullfish
Here is a link to macrame pixel knot (has a second name as well), but pixel seems to be common.
https://youtu.be/zd8ovw9WWZ4?si=puO4eRML0guu544S
Nowhere I could find an explanation, whether clean-back is an option and for macrame it does not really matter most of the times
halokiwi
Moderator
halokiwi
2 months, 1 week ago by halokiwi
To be honest, macrame pixel knot and upside-down alpha seem to be identical techniques to me. Can you explain what exactly the difference is?

Potentially, these are just different names for the same thing. Macrame has been around and then people rediscovered the technique when tying alphas.
halokiwi
Moderator
halokiwi
2 months, 1 week ago by halokiwi
If they are identical, what I said about upside-down alphas, applies to pixel macrame too:

You could tie a "regular" alpha that is mirrored using the clean-back alpha technique. In the end, both front and back will be clean. The "back" will be identical to upside-down alpha/pixel macrame and the "front" will be the clean "back" of the upside-down alpha/pixel macrame.

You could probably reverse engineer how to do the clean back while the back is your front. In the end, it doesn't really matter from which side you work. Both should work out.
shanianick
Professional
shanianick
2 months ago by shanianick
hey! thank you for making this thread, I've been trying to learn these techniques for the first time this week and it's been pretty confusing as I'm seeing some subtly different knots between pixel macrame vs upside down alpha techniques.
So far I've had the most luck with the pixel macrame technique as taught by Sheena Joy (aka Simply Inspired on Youtube), although I still need to figure out why my squares are coming out super squished.

I am less clear on exactly how most people knot when using the upside down alpha technique.

Not sure if this image link will work, but I tried to draw one variant I've seen of an upside down alpha knot, based on some youtube tutorials, next to a pixel macrame example (one half of a vertical double half hitch knot) https://i.imgur.com/18Rw9P6.png
This image might be super wrong cause I'm still trying to wrap my head around it!!

After I drew this I noticed the Advanced Knot Tutorial (https://www.braceletbook.com/tutorials/153_advanced-knots-tutorial/) includes an example of an upside down knot that's a lot closer to pixel macrame... but still subtly different if you pay attention to when the leading string and base string go over or under each other. So if you think of pixel macrame knots as being tied clockwise when traveling right/forward, it seems that upside down friendship bracelet knots tend to go counter-clockwise instead.

@Bullfish I'd love to know in more detail what upside down knotting means to you!
Bullfish
Advanced
Bullfish
2 months ago by Bullfish
@shanianick Honestly I love macrame pixel knot more than upside-down knotting, but I rarely do it due to the fact that I have not yet found a possibility doing a clean back. I am mostly doing bag-tags, keychains or bookmarks, so I need the clean back, but that does not work for me in macrame pixel and upside-down knotting.
I searched for alternative knots to get more square-like knots that neither lay to left or right side and both, macrame pixel and upside-down, techniques provide these, but clean back isn`t possible (at least not for me).
Personally I prefer macrame pixel knot. Even though there isn`t much of a difference between both techniques, it feels as if macrame pixel is easier for me (maybe because I am mainly left handed and backward knots are more comfortable for me). I don`t know.
Currently I am more into testing different embroidery floss and different base string brands and I hope to finally find the best combination for me so that my "normal" knotting becomes more even and knots do not move to right side on forward rows and to the left side on backward rows. Weaving in unused strands for clean back helps a bit, so I am testing thicker base strings currently. Also I slowed down my knotting to control each single knot better.

After all projects mustn`t be perfect, a touch of "charmingly selfmade" is fine 🙂
Mubsy
Skiller
Mubsy
1 month, 1 week ago by Mubsy
I have never heard of pixle knotting but I am going to try it as my knots are always angled which can ruin certain patterns.

Maybe a total rookie comment as I have only ever done upside down knotting once but it was clean backed.

I do not know the technique I used as it just seemed natural to do it the opposite (just sandwich the thread inside the knot so it is hidden) way to a normal alpha knot.

I wanted to experiment so I made a one colour simple moustache and (normal) alpha knotted the back ground and upside down knotted the moustache. I always take every strand to the end as I can often see a difference in the size my knots if I dont. I was quite pleased with the look but it wasn't well knotted at all as it was a 1st go.
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